Five successful female headteachers talk about how they got where they are, how they've stayed there, pay issues, industrial tribunals and the other challenges of the top job.
Does sexism still exist when it comes to the top job in schools? Does headship have to be frightening and off-putting, as the current crisis in recruitment suggests?
When primary headteacher Karen Giles was interviewed for the post, a governor asked her if she could do the job "with those nails". Secondary headteacher Clarissa Williams remembers being told she was being interviewed for a deputy headship because they needed a woman "to be in charge of the girls' toilets".
Have times changed since then? In an inspiring discussion, together with Bushra Nasir, Jacqueline Valin and Avril Dalglish, these women, with nearly 60 years experience in headship between them, share experiences and compare strategies and stories.